Seth Dobbs: Have you ever met someone who talks a big game, but struggles to turn words into action? Have you worked with someone that’s excellent at execution, but lacks true direction? Do you think that leadership is about grand visions and big ideas? Or is it about rolling up your sleeves and getting things done? Hi, I’m Seth Dobbs and this is the Principle Driven Leadership podcast where I share principles of leadership along with examples of how to apply them to help make you be the best leader you can be. These principles are based on my years of experience as an executive leader in building organizations and in coaching others to become leaders themselves. And I believe that not only can anyone develop leadership skills, but that everyone can and should develop leadership skills. I think they’re essential for helping you achieve your best in whatever way you might be trying to make an impact. And that’s because leadership skills help you better influence others to effectively create durable results. And leadership is a journey. The step we’re taking today, involves thinking about what leadership is and why it’s needed. Now there’s a lot of material and people out there talking about leaders about managers and bosses. And much of the content actually tries to differentiate all these things, and often elevates leader as something better than a manager and certainly better than a boss. Now ignoring the boss as a stereotype for now, I want to focus on the concept of leader versus manager. I’ve noticed a pattern of comparing the two. And basically the idea seems to be that a leader is nicer than a manager. Sometimes there’s even a bit of chest pounding where people declare I’m a leader, not just a manager. And through all this, some folks give the impression that they think of being a leader as being a big thinker, focusing only on the big ideas, the big strategy.

Sometimes it even seems like they think this is like a role that’s up in an ivory tower. The thing is regardless of what you call yourself, what your role is, you need leadership skills and management skills to be successful. Now there’s a great Japanese saying that captures why a balance is important and it goes like this. Vision without action is a daydream. Action without vision is a nightmare. So in this episode, I want to explore these two concepts. And we’ll start first with a story about Carlo. Carlo worked at an ad agency. He had a charismatic, demeanor, confident, he had great public speaking skills and an impressive resume.

And Carlo swiftly climbed the corporate ladder there. Now they were eager for higher level roles so that they could rise above the day-to-day details and really lead. However, typical of folks that say they want to be leaders, not managers, several problems occurred. First. Carlo was basically all talk,

no action. A master of rhetoric and frequently giving stirring speeches about the agency’s vision and creativity. But it rarely translated into results. Then there was the lack of clear direction while Carlo excelled at creating a semblance of enthusiasm and unity within the team during meetings and presentations their leadership lacked clear direction and team members were frequently left confused afterwards about what their actual priorities were.

Then there was the difficulty facing reality.

Carlo was averse to addressing conflicts and difficult conversations head on and they preferred to sweep issues under the rug hoping they would magically resolve themselves. And then there was the lack of accountability and despite numerous missed deadlines and unmet targets, Carlo seldom took responsibility for failures and instead would often place blame on external factors or even sometimes individual team members, further eroding trust within the team. And as a result of all this Carlo suffered from high turnover in their team. Now in this scenario because Carlo wanted to only be a leader and not a manager,

the ad agency suffered. Not only from a lack of productivity and innovation, but also from a toxic work environment created by an organizational leader who prioritized their image and reputation over the success and wellbeing of their team. Now, ultimately the agency needed a change in leadership to overcome these challenges and regain its competitive edge in the industry.

So as a contrast, I now want to offer a second story. And we’ll compare Carlo to Addison. Addison ran a local coffee shop near me for years. And over time she perfected the art of managing her coffee shop through carefully crafted processes and procedures. From brewing the perfect cup of coffee to managing inventory and scheduling staff.

She has a well-documented and repetitive process for everything. And with that, she provided a high touch, personal operation that ran like clockwork. And frankly, the espresso was great as well. Now I chatted with her a bit and about her operation and over time realized she was probably one of the most efficient managers I’ve met.

She is delivering a premium experience in a reliable, predictable manner. And then one day something unexpected happened. She arrived at work and saw a long queue of customers stretching out the door and around the corner. It was unusual to actually see such a rush and that big, a rush at that time of day.

And in some ways she had never seen it quite that big before. Now being a process focused manager, she immediately started to follow her well-established procedures. And instructed her staff to follow them to brew more coffee, prepare more pastries, et cetera. Per the normal approach. But even, so the line kept growing and customers grew impatient. Her heavy process oriented approach worked great for the expected traffic. But failed when demand changed and created an unexpected scenario. And she didn’t have the right staff, the right amount of staff for the moment.

She didn’t have any kind of quick serve options to keep traffic moving. And she was so locked in her standard process, there is no room for anyone to think creatively about the problem they were facing. Situation rapidly spiraled out of control, and she couldn’t handle it with her rigid processes. Her inability to adapt to the unexpected challenges led to a poor outcome as many customers left unsatisfied and the coffee shop’s reputation took a hit. Now, if we look at both of these stories, there’s actually some common elements. And the core similarity is that neither person understood what a leader’s role truly is. And even though each misunderstanding was different and in some ways sort of at opposite ends of the pole, Neither of them were defining the future in terms of outcomes. Neither of them were providing principles to guide their teams and ultimately each led to similar bad results.

So I want to revisit the saying, I started with. Vision without action is a daydream and action without vision is a nightmare. Carlo had the scenario that was vision without action. The daydream at the ad agency, right, was all just trying to be this big thinker, these big ideas without actually trying to get things done without being able to achieve them.

That’s not leading. It’s actually pontificating and it’s trying to sound wise, it’s going through the motions, “as seen on TV” leadership. This can be okay if you’re surrounded by others that can actually get things done. But the thing is the “I’m a leader, not a manager” type seems to want so badly to be inspirational and not get bogged down by bossing people. That they often miss the part about actually achieving results.

We need leaders to be more than people who just say a few good words. Now Addison on the other hand was all action without vision. And the nightmare that happened at the coffee shop came this only action focused: how to do my process, not, outcome focused: how do I best serve my customers, resulted in a mess and a reputational hit. Now what was happening that day represented a shift in her business.

And if it was a durable change, she needs to adapt. Of course, if it was one time, maybe she doesn’t really need to change how she did things. But maybe because she couldn’t adapt that sudden leap in demand would die and perhaps even worse things could happen. And again, this isn’t leading it’s operating, which is fine if there’s someone with leadership skills, helping overcome the unforeseen. But we need leaders that are more than just getting things done. But actually looking towards the future and providing a beacon to get there. Now the middle ground between these two stories is important because what really inspires people isn’t just someone that can say fabulous words, but can overcome problems and make that vision real. And that’s the thing leading is about achieving results. Getting to results takes both leadership skills and management skills. Leadership skills are about influencing others to effectively create durable results and I talk a lot about that in episode zero of the first season. Management skills by contrast are about directing others to efficiently create specific results. As a leader, you need both leadership skills and management skills. And depending on your role and where you are in your career, the balance of these skills will vary. Now I focus heavily on the leadership skills in these podcasts. Taking a vision and turning that into a beacon that drives to results-

it’s really what I focus on and less on the management side.

Leadership helps us navigate in the face of change. And that’s why it’s so important to embrace those skills. Leadership skills keep us looking beyond the next step. Through a vision defined by future outcomes. Through a mindset of facing reality and resolving problems and through creating more leaders that can refine the vision that can take on some of the outcomes themselves and resolve the problems that get in their way.

These leadership principles help us effectively create durable results even in the face of adversity, even in the face of change. Now if you’re only focused on doing, you’re not focused on leading. If you’re only focused on some pie in the sky view, but not actually getting your team there, you’re not leading. So I want you to think about where do you struggle in attaining a balance between leadership skills and management skills? Do you shy away from one aspect or another. And what strategies can you employ starting today that would help you balance vision and action? Thanks so much for joining me, please subscribe and share with a friend. And send feedback to contact@pdlpodcast.com and I’ll answer some questions later on in the season. Join me next time, where I’m going to talk about the importance of developing a vision for yourself.